Again with the Robots.

Andrew.C wrote: ... in fact, you better just explain point 2 more.

I would suggest (not hypothesize) that when something is able to think independently of it's creator/ controller it is sentient- and therefore capable of both 1) enhancing the situation of the world around it in a meaningful manner, and b) interacting meaningfully with other sentient creatures.

I suppose that this would begin to cause issues with persons with severe mental disabilities, and fetus'- along with copious other things i've forgotten to mention, so on with the can'o'worms! (we definitely need a smiley for can'o'worms and the opening thereof!)

Hmmm, ok. So are you saying that if a computer/machine could achieve 'independent thought,' then it would therefore be sentient, and therefore capable of 1) and b) (nice use of numbers and letters, by the way)?

And if that is the case (or even if it's not), what would be your opinion on the possibility of a comp attaining 'independent thought'?

Also I think 'meaningful' may need some clarification, though less important at the moment.

I doubt that computers will ever attain independent thought, seeing as computer programming (not that i'm and expert) is based on mathematical (and logical) algorithms- and the mind doesn't work like that, living things do irrational things all the time, and i doubt we have the know-how to reproduce that kind of "actual" intelligence (what was that from again?).

Mmm, fair enough. But I will just say that 'irrational' behaviour is entirely consistent with algorithms, at least so I've heard.

And I agree we probably don't have the know-how at this point in time, but, well, time makes fools of us all...

Not me!

actually computers do 'irrational' things all the time too (says tom, swiching sides). Humans/animals are mad by numbers. We think in numbers. We do everything in numbers, we walk, talk, catch, jump by numbers. Its just that the numbers used are hard wired in and are happening behind the eyes, so's you don't notice.

Good points. Perhaps you'd like to expand on your 'irrational' computer ideas, so we can get a better idea of them. If you want.

I will later

It's not that computers can be irrational, but humans are as perfectly rational, all the time, just like computers. Just like Tom said, we do everything by numbers. Everything that we do is based upon an input of information from our senses, and processed in ways that we have previously processed similar information. However, certain stimulus causes another variable to enter the equation. For example, if Tom were to say to me: 'Listen motherfucker, it's GO TIME', I would be inclined to think he was joking, and react in a particular way. If a total stranger said the same thing, then it's likely that an adrenaline surge would occur and my processing of the information would be altered by this new variable.

Theoretically, all humans would be perfectly predictable, but we lack the ability to study the human brain in all of it's complexity.

Listen MUTHA FUCKER! It's Go TIME!

*Simmo stops talking, turns and punches tom sqaa in the nuts

Glenjamin wrote:Not me!

That was a clock, Glenji. You can't hurt time.

I can if i want to!